• Enkrod@feddit.org
    16·
    2 天前

    I dunno… one reason the anti-queer rethoric is so prevalent is because in much media, but mostly comics, theater and movies, there is a tradition of queer-coded-evilness, and often it reads as evil-queerness. Mainly due to the american “code for media decency” preventing potraying queer people in positive light for many years.

    This came to associate queerness with perversion and malice and all the prejudice some people still associate gay people with today. And I don’t know if media-creators should play into that trope again.

    I mean yes, Scar, Jafar and Ursula were resplendend and fascinating in their fabulous evilness. Sophisticated, oozing sexuality, theatrical and intelligent. And that makes them fascinating, wonderful characters but damn… I’m just so fed up with the media vilifying queer- and trans-coding.

    And not only that, vilifying intelligence, the dramatic, sexual confidence and sophistication… or just british accents. The 90s Disneys movies were really really bad about all that.

    • Jankatarch@lemmy.world
      2·
      2 天前

      Thankfully it was mainly childrens shows that do this. Grown-up movies were busy doing it to Arabs instead.

      • Korronald@lemmy.world
        1·
        1 天前

        Except Bond movies or some Hitchcock’s and plenty of others. Queer coding villains is not only cartoon thing. But I don’t despite this. I even like, it’s ok as long as we can also have gay protagonists (can we?)

      • Enkrod@feddit.org
        1·
        2 天前

        Every movie that had Alan Rickman in it ever… it’s just more subtle when it’s not a cartoon.

    • RebekahWSD@lemmy.world
      1·
      1 天前

      I only know Agatha Harkness from Marvel’s Midnight Suns so I’m only vaguely aware she’s evil in other media?

      • BigBananaDealer@lemm.ee
        3·
        1 天前

        yes, if you want to see evil agatha in a non-comic book check out wandavision

        also midnight suns is an incredible game and i was surprised agatha was a hero 😂

        • RebekahWSD@lemmy.world
          3·
          1 天前

          It was such a good game! I’m sad it won’t get a sequel. Ebony is the best cat shaped cat like creature!

  • Delphia@lemmy.world
    81·
    2 天前

    I want to see more “Benign Queerness”

    Its briefly mentioned that the character is gay or bi or trans and then it never comes up again because its not relevant to their job in a hospital/cop/whatever.

    • pinball_wizard@lemmy.zip
      5·
      12 小时前

      I feel like Brooklyn 99 did this well. The chief Captain Holt is a really interesting nuanced character who happens to be gay.

      • exasperation@lemm.eeEnglish
        5·
        1 天前

        Minor nitpick: he was Captain, not Chief.

        And him trying to pass for straight was some of the funniest scenes in the show:

        Guard: It just seems like you wanna be with Jamie-Lynn. I mean, you keep talking about her thigh gap.

        Captain Holt: That’s my favorite part of a woman. There’s nothing more intoxicating than the clear absence of a penis.

    • Revan343@lemmy.ca
      2·
      1 天前

      Kids show, but Kipo and the Age of Wonderbeasts did that pretty well with one of the main cast

    • sness@sh.itjust.works
      1·
      1 天前

      Magic: tG has a few characters. Comes out as queer in a book, never mentioned on any card except maybe during pride month.

    • Krudler@lemmy.worldEnglish
      2·
      2 天前

      I need every character who is gay to be portrayed as a jellybean-throwing simpleton. That way I know they’re gay.

      • Delphia@lemmy.world
        2·
        1 天前

        I had a buddy growing up who had a really hard time coming to terms with being gay because he really loved lifting weights, football, dirt bikes and hard rock. He was “One of the boys” in an era when most of the portrayal of gay people in popular media was (and I say this with all love) mostly flamboyant lisping queens.

        Fortunately his story had a happy ending, but role models are important.

        • Krudler@lemmy.worldEnglish
          1·
          1 天前

          I’m very gender fluid even though I’m straight af. I don’t even know what the hell’s going on with my gender identity to be honest I don’t know the magic words and I don’t even care because I accept myself for who I am finally. I would have loved to know it’s okay to not align myself or portray myself as the stereotypical man because I don’t feel that way inside. Basically I’m agreeing with you but in my own way.

      • Enkrod@feddit.org
        13·
        2 天前

        Queer coding doesn’t necessary mean the character has to be queer, they just have to express stereotypical queer attributes, like wearing makeup (check), being sophisticated (check), having a flair (check) for the dramatic (check) being sexually confident (check) or even aggressive (check), displaying style and grace (check) while being intelligent (check) but not physically strong (check). Then there is the typical Disney-villain-physicality which also reads as queer coded, heavy lidded eyes, tightly trimmed beards, long faces (just look at Jafar and Scar next to each other)

        In Jafar’s case he was animated by an openly gay animator and sang music written by an openly gay lyricist, both visibly had a lot of fun creating this fabulous mess of an evil sorcerer.

          • Enkrod@feddit.org
            41·
            2 天前

            Please don’t. I really hate the “the anti-gay crowd is secretly gay”-narrative, because it carries connotations of “the gays” being responsible for their own oppression.

            • uncle_moustache@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
              3·
              1 天前

              It’s not so much a “narrative” as a well studied phenomenon among all oppressed groups.

              There are individuals in all oppressed groups who, for complicated reasons, enable the cycle of oppression by policing peers, enforcing harmful norms, and seeking proximity to power at their own group’s expense. (I’m making an observation and not a moral judgement)

              See: internalized oppression, horizontal hostility, identification with the aggressor(s)

            • outhouseperilous@lemmy.dbzer0.com
              1·
              2 天前

              I don’t know, is an attraction to upholtered furbiture queer or a kink?

              Because thats not exactly a secret, we just have to figure out what category it’s in.

          • Enkrod@feddit.org
            2·
            1 天前

            Yes, in that stereotype being worldly and educated is presented as foreign, urban, sinful, often depraved and in contrast to the supposed “purity” of small-town innocence and virginity. Remember that these stereotypes originated in the 1950s and are mostly the result of puritan, white, middle class, anglo-saxon, protestant worldviews. It’s the reason that so many villains in american movies (among others Shere Khan, Jafar and Scar) have british accents, while the heroes (like Aladdin) talk with a midwestern accent.

          • Enkrod@feddit.org
            2·
            2 天前

            Imho. queer coding means “can be read as queer” (but doesn’t have to be) while a stereotype would be a queer person displaying stereotypical attributes.

            I mean… those are bad stereotypes, the overwhelming number of gay people I have ever met do not express most of those attributes, they mainly exist because they were used to vilify queer people during the times of the Hayes Code and because when TV wasn’t allowed to show queerness, theater still was, so queer media became dominated by the theatrical.

      • Protoknuckles@lemmy.world
        1·
        2 天前

        While he does seem attracted to Jasmine, he’s also very theatrical and campy in a way that was heavily associated with homosmsexuality in the 90s.

      • themeatbridge@lemmy.world
        23·
        2 天前

        Well, Gaston isn’t really attracted to anyone but himself. He’s a classic narcissist, and his pursuit of Belle is purely to feed his ego. If he could have sex with himself, he would. Vigorously, and somehow selfishly.

        Le Fou, on the other hand, is an effeminate sycophant. The live action explicitly makes him gay, but the animated version merely suggests it. Singing about how handsome and manly he is, and how much everybody wants to wrestle with Gaston with the biting and the spitting and the hair-covered inches.

      • GraniteM@lemmy.world
        2·
        2 天前

        Gaston has a trio of smoking hot blondes that are all over him, but he goes for the bookworm who wants nothing to do with him. He wants a wife who won’t care when he goes on extended “hunting trips” with his manly man buddies, not one who will be all over him in the bedroom.

    • GraniteM@lemmy.world
      2·
      1 天前

      Interestingly enough…

      Hannibal Lecter: Look for severe childhood disturbances associated with violence. Our Billy wasn’t born a criminal, Clarice. He was made one through years of systematic abuse. Billy hates his own identity, you see, and he thinks that makes him a transsexual. But his pathology is a thousand times more savage and more terrifying.